Examining the home price boom and its effect on owners, lenders, regulators, realtors and the economy as a whole.
Thursday, February 02, 2006
The Good News Is The Bubble's Temporary
Two analysts see a housing bubble in San Diego, but expect different outcomes. "'Generally good news in terms of San Diego, we will outperform California and the rest of the nation,' (said) Alan Gin, an associate professor of economics. Housing prices should appreciate by about 5 percent or less, and the time it takes to sell a house is expected to increase, Gin said."
"'Almost everywhere I go, people ask me if we're in a housing bubble here in San Diego,' Gin said. 'My answer is yes, but the bubble isn't going to burst.'"
"Housing demand should continue to outstrip availability, because the relatively strong job market, he said. Downtown, however, may have an oversupply of condominiums."
But Rich Toscano sees it this way. "The conventional wisdom among both real estate industry insiders and the populace at large goes something like this: San Diego has not built enough houses to support population growth. San Diego continues to not build enough houses to support population growth. San Diego will never build enough houses to support population growth. And that's why housing is, and will ever be, so expensive."
"The San Diego housing supply has more than kept pace with population growth in recent years. Therefore, the sharp increase in home prices is not explained by a housing shortage as is widely believed. As it happens, I entirely agree that there is a severe housing affordability problem in San Diego. Put another way, San Diego housing is overpriced. Really, really overpriced."
"Even at the very peak of the late-1980s housing bubble, people were paying about 10 times per capita income to purchase a median-priced home, compared to almost 15 times per capita income now. The good news is that the affordability problem is, by its very nature, temporary."
"Consider the fact that San Diego scored an eight on the California Association of Realtors' most recent Affordability Index reading. Only the highest-paid 8 percent of San Diegans can afford the median-priced home. Does this really seem like a sustainable situation?"
"Home equity withdrawal and loose lending have served as props under the San Diego housing market, allowing home prices to remain far above what local wages would normally allow. Were home prices to remain flat and lenders to substantially tighten their standards, these artificial props under the housing market would be removed, resulting in a situation where very few people were able, let alone willing, to purchase homes at current prices."
"We live in an uncertain world, but I say the following with great confidence: unless wages start rising very fast, San Diego home prices will eventually have to fall. One way or another, the housing affordability problem will fix itself."
Forbes has more detail on the CA defaults.
ReplyDelete'In Los Angeles, default notices are up 10.7%; in San Francisco, they are up 45.2%; in Napa, they are up a whopping 175%.'
San Diego condos for everybody!
ReplyDelete[Well, at least Dr. Gin got one thing right]
ben said:
ReplyDelete"Forbes has more detail on the CA defaults.
'In Los Angeles, default notices are up 10.7%; in San Francisco, they are up 45.2%; in Napa, they are up a whopping 175%.'"
********
The Forbes article says Q4 2005 default notices were up up 19% from the previous quarter and up 15.6% from 2004.
There also was this:
"But the number of default notices sent out in California was dramatically lower than in 1996, when nearly 60,000 were recorded in the first quarter, says DataQuick, which has been tracking defaults since 1992."
So is there really any logical way to compare the housing-economic environment of 1996 to today?
Only if one includes the fact that in 1996 it was toward the end of the "era of fear" in housing.
Whereas today, it's just the opposite - and the beginning of another new, long "era of fear."
Professor Gin is like most individuals of academia, he doesn't know DICK.
ReplyDelete"Relatively strong job growth?" Oh yeah? I bet the majority of new jobs being created in San Diego County are really high paying friggin' jobs. For instance, if I lose my well paying tech job in San Diego, I'm looking for work at the local Starbucks; that's no joke.
"Housing demand will always outstrip housing availability?" Oh yeah?, that's why I see housing structures going up EVERYWHERE in this county with seemingly no end in sight, and the population growth that in fact is affecting San Diego is due to illegal immigration. I guess if you can 40-50 illegals to pool their money, maybe they can afford a median price house in San Diego.
Dipshits like this so-called professor Gin need to go away....far, far away
hedgefund -
ReplyDeleteYou are beginning to confirm a truism that many people hold with regard to the behavior of New Yawkers (hint: it starts with an "a" and ends with "holes").
I thought you were beyond that - must be all the bonus money going to your head.
Rich Toscano is certinly not a 'dork' as earlier stated. He has an entire website that provides lots of solid data. Just because he didn't mention a specific point in 'this' article...he has plenty of graphs/data on the subject of inventory.
ReplyDeleteAbout his charging for the 'premium' content. He is putting a lot of work in...just like Ben, myself, and other bloggers that are getting thousands of readers per day. Eventually, you are spending sooo much time, you need to do something to make some money.
It costs money to host sites, and keep them running, not to mention the costs of purchasing the data that he (Prof Piggington) compiles.
Keep up the great work Rich and Ben!
SoCalMtgGuy
Another F@CKED Borrower
"Only the highest-paid 8 percent of San Diegans can afford the median-priced home. Does this really seem like a sustainable situation?"
ReplyDeleteSure, as long as easy, toxic loans are available to anyone breathing and crooked appraisers continue to overvalue property. ;-)
Things are getting a little snippy in here. Perhaps we should save the personal insults for the people that really deserve them... Lereah and all the greedy sons of bitches that contributed to this housing bubble. And another thing, I keep hearing people talk about how sorry they are for FB's. I say F 'em. No money down? interest only? negative savings?? boat buying? Yeah, that makes sense.
ReplyDeleteI'm probably going to annoy everyone again by saying this, but here goes:
ReplyDeleteSan Diego will will crash. But. It will not go to zero, and it will not become a Mexican city. San Diego has the best weather of any U.S. city, and much of is beautiful, especially the areas outside of downtown.
Commenters on this board seem to be conflating Dr. Gin's statements with those of that Rich Toscano person.
Regardless, there will be a time in the near future when SD SFHs are much, much less expensive; but that will be the time to buy, not the time to gloat over the demise of SD as a place to own or live.
As we all should know by now, the price of housing in bubble markets such as SD is not a function of real supply and demand, but a function of a buying panic and cheap money. This aberration will be dealt with bby the market in due time, although not as quickly as some might hope. Housing prices do not exhibit the same volitility as NASDAQ stocks over the same time periods - it takes longer for prices to adjust than a few seconds on a day trader's screen.
Some of the commentary I've seen on this board recently looks as overheated as the Yahoo boards looked in 1999 and Spring 2000. Some folks need to take a breath and let this breakdown take its course.
Just my HO, of course.
pop goes the weasel said...
ReplyDelete"Things are getting a little snippy in here. Perhaps we should save the personal insults for the people that really deserve them..."
I agree. I always look forward to both GetStucco's and HFA's comments and it would be unfortunate if either of them ran the other off.
rainman: That is so true. The guy who bought my place had one of those names that ended in 'z'. He didn't speak English, so it took days to get things communicated.
ReplyDeleteBut hey, I'm a happy camper as I got more than my asking price and waivers of inspections...
Pogue,
ReplyDeleteHoly crap. Look at Bakersfield!
http://www.housedata.info/CA/Bakersfield/
I think Bakersfield will win the grand prize for the greatest boom-to-bust cycle in the history of US real estate. Unbelievable!
I don't think Alan Gin is an expert on real estate prices. I've read on this blog (from a poster who met him) that he started by collecting and publishing data about San Diego's economy and that people started to send him more data to add to his stats.
ReplyDelete'I'm interested in how many people on this blog are poised to take advantage of an 'opportunity' when the market changes versus people hiding in the grass throwing rocks at the parade?'
ReplyDeleteThat's funny BKL, thanks!
Unemployment, wage, and jobs data released over the past 2 days points to future rate hikes.. Many readers here were certain that Bernanke would pause at his first meeting.
ReplyDeleteLook for two more rate hikes in the near future..
grim
Northern NJ Real Estate Bubble
Auction Heaven 07 Wrote:
ReplyDelete"I've been prudent with my finances.
I saw this coming a year and a half ago, and started saving for it.
My wife and I paid off all of our debt, have near perfect credit scores, and have $60,000+ sitting in a CD in the bank.
It's because of people like us that I know there won't be a recession, even if home prices drop 50%.
There's millions of us out here."
It refreshing to hear from people who have been responsible with their money. However you and other responsible - financially well off people will not be able to prevent the coming recession.
The macro economic conditions are aligned in such away that the recession is almost inevitable.
David
Bubble Meter blog
Mr. d.
ReplyDeleteI completely disagree with your analysis...but in the short time I've been reading this blog, have come to respect your view.
I'm certainly one of those people who believes "the consumer is totally - this time I'm sure - is completely tapped out." And I've been wrong for at least two years. Why? Exotic mortgages. e.g., I only recently learned of Option ARM's where you pay what you want/can and simply let unpaid principle/interest roll back into your mortgage. Which is to say...no matter how tapped how the consumer appears to be, the lenders keep finding new ways to justify loans.
Switching gears...
If the San Diego area became "affordable", I'd leave Miami in a heartbeat.